[Capler]

Carowinds and the coaster enthusiast. A brief history of the love to hate relationship.

I’ve been on coaster forums for about 20 years now, and I have noticed that our beloved park struggle to gain much respect within the coaster community. I know enthusiast are a fickled group that tend to favor certain parks, rides, and manufacturers, which makes it very difficult for outliers to break through.

Back in the days Kings Entertainment, the park was well respected when compared to it’s regional peers. Except for acreage, Carowinds pretty much had the same attractions Island, Dominion and other comparable parks had. As a matter of fact, in the 1970’s Carowinds compactness was an advantage because folk complained about walking distance and empty spaces you found between attractions at larger parks.

Things changed during the Paramount years when Island and Dominion became the flagship parks for the company. Enthusiast then deemed Carowinds as being too small, and as being one great coaster away from greatness. Well, we got that one great coaster in Top Gun 19 years ago, but mostly enthusiast were not impressed, because by this time parks such as Cedar Point, Magic Mountain, and Great Adventure were installing multiple ‘great’ attractions.


This brings us to the Cedar Fair years. First we got the boomerang while Dominion got the floorless coaster. Many enthusiast felt that was the proper order because Dominion was more deserving. Our next coaster should have put Carowinds over the top in the eyes of enthusiast, but it did not. Unfortunately something strange happened as we received the world’s tallest B&M hyper coaster. First, coaster purist had fallen out of favor with B&M because of their practice of controlling the ride experience and secondly, Dominion installed an Intamin designed Intimidator at the same time. They praised I-305 and crowned our coaster as being the worst B&M hyper ever built.

Next up was Fury. Initially the coaster community struggled to say anything good about it. As a matter of fact, the web master of a particular site, who shall remain nameless, rode Fury, and in his typical smugness, all he could bring himself to say was, ‘well it is fast’, and that was the only praise he was willing to give. But as things would have it, enthusiast who took the time to actually ride Fury deemed it as one of the better coasters out there. With that said, a funny thing happened on the way to Fury’s coronation; Afterburn got caught in the up draft. We always knew we had one of the better inverts, but it took Fury and 15 years later before enthusiast realized it. Go figure!

Today, even with Fury, Intimidator, and Afterburn, which represents a stellar lineup, the coaster community has once again raised the bar, as it relates to our potential 2019 coaster. Now they are saying we can never be good because we have too many bad coasters, we have no good wood, we have no launch coaster. Last year, our kiddie area was lame, -we fixed that. The year before, we did not have enough flats, -we fixed that. Three years ago, our water park could not compete. Four years ago our dinning establishments lacked.

Now they are telling us what our 2019 coaster should be. ‘If it is a Mack, it should not spin. Better yet Mack should not build it at all. It never ends.

I said this to say that you will never satisfy a group of enthusiast. Carowinds numbers up and regardless of what they say about intimidator, the general pubic loves it.

[Jrlooney88]

Solid post, I too hate seeing negative comments about Carowinds on other forums, I've pretty much just chalked it up to either internet trolls, unpleasable folks, or people that are simply jealous about all the attention and investment this park has been receiving recently.

I like where the park is at, and where the park is headed. I'm sure Cedar Fair eventually wants us at the 3 Million + attendance mark, but with that comes longer lines, and I heard that there was a 5 HOUR wait to ride Steel Vengeance this weekend.

[tarheel1231]

TBH this post seems a bit petty and unnecessary.

[Capler]

TBH this post seems a bit petty and unnecessary.

A little grown folk talk tarheel, sometimes in life it is better to say nothing and keep moving. Don't be the dog that leaves a turd on the neighbor's lawn, just to let them know, he's been there.

[tarheel1231]

I probably should have elaborated. Your post seems to be criticizing other enthusiasts for having opinions. Carowinds is a fine park, sure, but there is little of note here that would impress people who have visited several hundred theme parks. Naturally, we’re going to be more biased to Carowinds with it being our home park.

The part I of your post I DO agree with is the last section about enthusiasts trying to dictate what parks need and don’t need, acting as armchair CEO’s and then getting pissed when the park doesn’t follow the exact plan they THINK they should follow. It’s honestly pretty toxic and it makes the community almost as bad as the Star Wars fandom in that regard.

[Capler]

[Removed by moderator]

As it relates to being critical of Carowinds, yes some folk opinions are based on experience, but what I have seen enthusiast do is rank a coaster solely on how intense the ride is. If a group of people say a ride is good because it is the most intense, sadly other enthusiast will fall in line and espouse the same thing. That has little to do with how traveled you are but speaks to a perceived preference. I like intense coasters, but I factor in a lot of other things as well. Let me compare Fury and I-305. Enthusiast love 305, but IMO, overall Fury is more complete. For me 305 gives me a headache because of the intensity after a few rides. I can ride Fury without that. But that is me.

[Jay]

Let's keep it classy here folks, no need for all of this off topic conversation...

Regarding your post, I definitely know how you feel. Carowinds is like family, and you can make fun of your family and point out their faults, but as soon as someone from "outside" the family does it you feel protective. I think with Fury (and to a lesser extent Intimidator) Carowinds got a whole bunch of publicity, so naturally you'll hear more comments from people who have never been before. Obviously every comment isn't going to be good, but people are allowed to express their opinion even if it's negative (unless they are just trolling).

The important thing is that Carowinds is growing by huge leaps and bounds every year. It's been a park in transition for the better part of a decade, and is still transitioning to be able to compete with the "big boys." All us locals can do is support it, regardless of what they add or what other people say about it.

[tarheel1231]

Yeah I acknowledge the park isn’t perfect, far from it. But I remember what it was five years ago. Two decent coasters, asphalt walkways, a laughably undersized water park, and food that would make a school cafeteria seem like a fine dining experience. In five years, we’ve received:

-Harmony Hall, and several other new restaurants
-Dorsal Fin Drop and Surfer’s Swell (best slide in the Harbor IMO)
-A new entry plaza, tool booth, and a new parking lot
-Fury 325 & Slingshot
-Plantz vs. Zombies Garden Warfare: 3Z Arena
-An overhaul of the water park to reflect regional culture, featuring a new wave pool, a six-slide complex, a water park gate, and several infrastructure upgrades
-FOUR new flat rides, bolstering the park’s non-coaster lineup
-Winterfest
-A decently themed Camp Snoopy

And next year, it looks as if we’re slated to get a new launch coaster, something that hasn’t been seen at the park in almost four decades.

The park still has a long way to go before it can be considered one of the country’s best regional parks, but it’s certainly on its way there.

[arby]

The coaster enthusiast community, like a lot of enthusiast communities, is entire subjective. There are different broad types within the community.

Some think a coaster shouldn't be built, or isn't good, if it isn't the tallest, fastest, wildest, etc., coaster.

There are others who are enthusiasts for the engineering and aesthetics of a ride.

Then there are those, me included, who are just in it for the fun of it. When I get off of a coaster, if I think 'that was fun, I want to ride it again' then it is a good coaster in my book.

Based on the three larger groups I have observed, I usually take what I hear from enthusiasts as a grain of salt. You are never going to please everyone, and usually the first group tends to be the most vocal. So I ignore them and go about my business to have some fun.

With all of the parks that I have been to, I continue to be happy that Carowinds is my home park as there are many more that I wouldn't want as my home park. Let them bash the park, we're such a small percentage of the park going population, that it doesn't matter. Keep the GP coming, and they will continue investing in the park.

[uscbandfan]

Speaking of getting a headache, I sure wish Fury would fix that <doggone> vibration!!!!

If the vibration was gone, it would by far be my most favorite of all time. Not because its the biggest, tallest and fastest. It's just the most fun for me... although I'm sure being the biggest, tallest and fastest is part of what makes it the most fun.
Case in point, my second most favorite coaster (of any park) is Swamp Fox. Not the biggest or longest or anything like that. It's just fun.

[Top Gun68]

I agree with this post.

I'm a Carowinds kid. My first roller coaster was Scooby-Doo. I remember crying because I wasn't tall enough to ride Top Gun. I've worked at Carowinds 2 seperate seasons. Whenever I go to Carowinds with friends I am always the "tour guide". I could go through the park blindfolded if needed. Safe to say Carowinds is what made me the coaster enthusiast I am today.

When i was younger my parents weren't really up for travelling. This meant Carowinds was really the only option I had to get my roller coaster fix. Top Gun became my favorite roller coaster (see username). I would marathon it on days when the park was empty. Even then I was envious of other parks. I wondered if Carowinds would ever get a good roller coaster or was Top Gun the best we could get while the rest of the rides were just clones.

I was excited when Borg was announced, but at the same time I still wasn't satisfied knowing it was just relocated from another park.

When Intimidator was announced I thought this was finally it. Finally Carowinds would have its big name roller coaster. While I did love Intimidator I found myself still not satisfied.

Then Fury 325 was announced. This time I told myself I wouldn't get excited for it until I ride/see it myself. I remember the first time I saw it from the road. I remember walking up to North Gate feeling like I was in a dream. This roller coaster is really at Carowinds? Essentially in my backyard?

The first ride was a blur, but I remember hitting the brakes and thinking "this is it. This is a dream come true."

So yes, while I dont necessarily care about other enthusiasts opinions, I have still always wanted Carowinds to have that marquee roller coaster that people would rave about.

On to 2019!

[Capler]

Top Gun,

For most of my life I was fairly happy with Carowind's coaster selection. At least I was satisfied until KD & BG started installing really great rides 20 odd yeas ago. Though FOF was not the best coaster on the planet, the theming and the launch into darkness was second to none. Then there was the Volcano blast experience. Alepengeist and Apollo were surreal. That is when I became a little disgruntled with our park. Top Gun was the fix for me. I had ridden Montu several years earlier, and in my book it was world class. I was very happy to receive our Baby Montu.

I'm very happy to have Cedar as an owner because apparently they know how to run a amusement park. They shy away for the gimmicks, and put in rides that are reliable, predictable and stand the test of time.

I think the problem with Paramount was that they were trying to be a Disney lite. It is impossible to be somewhat like Disney and be successful. You have to go all out, which will cost you a fortune.

When Cedar Fair mentioned a few years beck that they were going to make our park the Cedar Point of the south, I thought they were simply attempting to extort money for the Charlotte council to help fund the
Gate Keeper like coaster they were planning here.

Here we are 5 years later, and Carowinds is beginning to look more like Cedar Point than even Kings Island and Dominion. The two aforementioned parks still have a strong legacy of previous owners. I can't say that about Carowinds. Fair is aggressively ripping out and reconfiguring some of the decisions of the past.

Seeking of that, I don't see Vortex, Cyclone, Night Hawk, and Hurler having much of a future in the park. If they RMC Hurler, completely remove the others, and add one good replacement for the three, the park will be straight. I'm not saying those coaster are bad, but they are past their prime. Cyclone was great back in 1980 when coasters seldom went above 100 feet tall, and few had multiple loops. Vortex has always been a nut cracker, but it was an unique experience you enjoyed. NightHawk needs to go because it's taking up prime real estate. Personally I'd rather have Smurf Island, and the ship-on-a-rail, than to have Night Hawk in that location. They should take out Hawk and
send it to Michigan Adventure. Can you imagine being a Michigan fan, and have to constantly put up with this kind of talk? Everything enthusiast don't like gets sent to Michigan Adventure.

[Jrlooney88]

Totally agree with removing Nighthawk and Vortex and using that spot for a new ride, something like Gold Striker at CGA where it wraps around the Sky Tower would be very neat centerpiece.

I'd like to see Cyclone remain, regardless of how far past its prime it is, Cyclone was an impressive feat and a first of a kind when it opened. Plus, its definitely a good starter roller coaster for someone that still hasn't worked up the courage to ride our Big 3.

[tarheel1231]

Cyclone is the park's 5th most ridden attraction after Hurler.

Enthusiasts don't like Nighthawk, but again, we make up such a minuscule percentage of the park's attendance that our opinions don't matter. It's one of the park's signature attractions, so I think we see some sort of higher capacity train upgrade in the future.

Vortex is a coaster that has been eyed by Cedar Fair executives as being a candidate for a floorless conversion, so I think we can expect this to happen by 2021. Adds another decent capacity attraction to the park's lineup, so I would think they'd want to keep it as a floorless.

[Capler]

Honestly, I hope Vortex does not get the conversion treatment. My feeling is that if it was going to happen it would have happened for 2019 or even 2018. Instead, they are potentially putting in another steel looper. It seems kind of crazy to invest in 'Alpha' then double back in a few years and do a lack luster Vortex conversion. It would seem difficult to market that, especially with Cyclone sitting near by. From the little I read, Patriot's reviews are mixed . That could be the reason we might not see it done here. But hey, what do I know?