Everything else goes here, including discussion of parks outside of Carowinds and any off-topic discussion
#91304
Any time someone takes a ride in anything, they're taking some responsibility.

You can act like federal regulation is the answer, but there is no one size fits all. IAAPA has been around and there are tons of industry professionals that you say should be working for the Feds that are IAAPA members, and those professionals seem to think the current system works. It should be up to the states. Like Rollet said, more federal employees means more costs put on us.

Plus you're still going off the assumption that this accident wasn't human error and that hasn't been proven yet as far as I can tell in an ongoing investigation.
#91329
Remember, we are supposed to be the 'United States' of America, not the federal government. Our country was founded with minimal federal government involvement and protection for each state. Each state is allowed to make its own laws and regulations, as long as they don't go against the constitution.

Amusement parks, are by and far, regional entertainment venues. There is no need for the feds to get involved and each state should be allowed to conduct safety inspections as they see fit. If the state and/or a business has questionable practices, then usually the federal government steps in and we see those in question sit in front of a congressional hearing.

The system, as is, works more or less, without needing any more federal government involvement, in my opinion. Amusement park rides are inherently safe as hundreds of millions of rides (maybe more) are taken each year with a very small percentage of fatalities.

It will be interesting to see what the investigation finds in fault for this particular ride. Afterwards, a discussion will be more relevant. Quoting news sources is inherently risky as they tend to quickly rush to judgement before the facts are known. With social media taking over the news networks, fact checking is becoming a lost art for major news networks, as they are in a rush to beat social media.
User avatar
By Axel
#91354
arby wrote:It will be interesting to see what the investigation finds in fault for this particular ride. Afterwards, a discussion will be more relevant.

I agree, and will make no more comments on Verrückt. Realize that they do not have to disclose any findings on that investigation and most sources say they haven't in similar investigations in the past and probably won't in this case.
The system, as is, works more or less, without needing any more federal government involvement, in my opinion. Amusement park rides are inherently safe as hundreds of millions of rides (maybe more) are taken each year with a very small percentage of fatalities.

This brings us to the larger picture and can definitely be discussed. I found this article pretty much sums up those (like me) that would like to see Federal oversight...

"On Roller Coasters and Regulation
August 28th, 2013

In May of this year, we posted an article about the surprising prevalence of injuries to children at amusement parks. In the first study of its kind, a team of researchers based in Columbus, Ohio estimate that nearly 4500 children under the age of eighteen are injured on amusement park rides each year. The attractions in question “included anything from coin-operated rides to Ferris wheels, carousels, bumper cars, roller coasters, and any type of ride like that.” An additional article in Smithsonian claims that the most common of these injuries are to the head and neck; ten percent (about 450 annually) involve broken bones and six percent require overnight hospital stays. While these relatively tame attractions injure thousands a year, roller coaster parks like the Six Flags chain present a risk of even more serious accidents.

Earlier this summer, 52-year-old Dallas woman Rosa Irene Ayala-Gaona died after falling more than 70 feet from her roller coaster car at Six Flags Over Texas. According to legal blog ThePopTort.com, roller coaster rides are based upon outdated models of rider weight (the average weight of adult males in this country has risen by about thirty pounds over the last three decades). This presents a serious risk. Heavier riders means more stress on machinery, including restraint bars and belts. One roller coaster safety expert claims most seats and restraints are designed to accommodate riders that weigh around 180 pounds.

The authors of the Columbus, Ohio-based pediatric study lament, “Although the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission has jurisdiction over mobile rides, regulation of fixed-site rides is currently left to state or local governments, leading to a fragmented system […] A coordinated national system would help us prevent amusement ride-related injuries through better injury surveillance and more consistent enforcement of standards.”

This is the case in Texas as well, where there is such a dearth of relevant legislation that no investigation has been conducted. There is simply no authority whose job it is to investigate cases like this. Apparently, the only safety measures required of parks in Texas is passing one safety inspection a year and proving that it has at least a million dollars in liability insurance. ThePopTort adds that at least seventeen states lack state agencies responsible for ensuring the safety of amusement park rides.

Members of congress have noted this serious and dangerous lack of oversight and regulation: Senator Ed Markey of Massachusetts points out, “A baby stroller is subject to tougher federal regulation than a roller coaster carrying a child in excess of 100 miles per hour. This is a mistake.”

In Pennsylvania, amusement parks have a reputation for vigorously defending all personal injury lawsuits to create a zero sum game for attorneys who file these legitimate cases. Well-paid large law firms will fight a war of attrition with plaintiff’s counsel rather than resolve to make their parks safer and resolve the meritorious claims.

Pennsylvania parks are notorious for warning signs, which, they contend, immunizes them from liability for their negligent inspections and maintenance of rides: “The rides in this park have been inspected as required by the Pennsylvania Amusement Ride Inspection Act.” As mentioned earlier, the thoroughness of these inspections is a point of contention for watchdog groups, due especially to the lack of a clearly designated agency whose job it is to ensure the safety of such parks."
#91359
Two things about that article, those studies take in to account any and every reported injury on a ride, including things like people bumping their elbows on the ride.

The Texas Giant accident was human error more than anything else.

I still think federal oversite is still unnecessary.
#91362
I respect your right to think we need more federal oversight. I still don't think we need it. In fact, that article solidified it for me. Let's pick some number that is probably low-ball based on what I've seen in my trips to different parks: 1,000,000. Let's say that 1,000,000 total annual amusement park rides across the country are by children 18 and under. so 1,000,000/4500 (injuries) * 100 = .45%. I'm sure the percentage is actually quite lower than that.

On a completely unrelated topic, I have a stock tip for anybody interested. As of yesterday, I am up 101% and expect this to continue to do well. They are a Canadian company in Ontario called Canopy Growth Corporation (TWMJF in the US). They are one of the few authorized marijuana growers in Canada. If you weren't aware, marijuana will be legal in Canada in the spring of 2017. They have been expanding rapidly to meet the anticipated demand next year.
#91399
I would think that every amusement park operator would love to build a park in Orlando - the Mecca of year-round amusement parks on the east coast. I don't think Six Flags or Cedar Fair have the resources to compete with the big players there.

I do know Ferrari World wants to build a park in the U.S. and Orlando is one location they were considering. 200 acres seems small for them, though, since they like to go big. Who knows, but more competition is good for all of us.
#91400
Dreamworld accident: 4 dead in Queensland theme park ride malfunction

Billed as a family ride, the Thunder River Rapids Ride has had problems in the past, including one almost-fatal incident in April

http://www.planetrock.com/news/videos/four-dead-in-accident-at-dreamworld-theme-park-on-australias-gold-coast/

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Busch Gardens Closes Ride After Deaths at Australia Theme Park
TAMPA, Fla. — Busch Gardens Tampa Bay in Florida has decided to close a river rapids ride after four people were killed on a similar water ride at an amusement park in Australia.

A statement issued by the attraction confirmed the Congo River Rapids ride was shut down Tuesday "out of an abundance of caution" while they work to understand what happened in Australia.

EFTELING WON'T CHANGE RIDE AFTER FATAL AUSTRALIA ACCIDENT
http://nltimes.nl/2016/10/25/efteling-wont-change-ride-fatal-australia-accident
Dutch amusement park Efteling has no plans to make adjustments to its ride Pirana following a fatal accident with a similar white water attaction in Australia, a spokesperson for Efteling said to RTL Nieuws.

Four people were killed in the Dreamworld theme park in Australia's Gold Coast this morning when the boat they were in overturned on the ride Thunder River Rapids.

According to the spokesperson, the Pirana is siminal to the Thunder River Rapids, but its more like its "calm little brother". The Efteling ride never reaches the Australian one's top speed of 45 kilometers per hour.

"We are folling the investigation in Australia closely, but as yet there is no reason to take action. The irana is not only much calmer, it also seems that the people in Australia were wearing a safety belt in the attaction. In that too there's a difference."

stupid statement by Efteling! potential flaws in the conveyor system has nothing to do with the speed of the ride or safety belts!

Axel edit 10/31/16:
The leading reason put forth for this accident is the routine failure of the rides water pump:
Theme park admits Rapids ride pump failed regularly... Police have called for a meeting with the water pump’s ­manufacturer tomorrow as Queensland’s Workplace Health and Safety officials continue their audit of theme park rides across the state.

The hydraulic pump is understood to have failed twice last Tuesday before the accident in which a raft carrying four adults and two children crashed into an empty raft in front that appeared to have stalled at the bottom of a conveyor belt. The raft flipped, dumping the occupants into the water and the machinery that ­operated the conveyor belt.

An engineer was seen spending up to half an hour examining the popular water ride in the hours before the accident.

A local resident and regular visitor to the park, who wished to be known only as Ben and reportedly has been interviewed by police, said the water level was “like a pool that obviously needed to be topped up”.

“The empty tube was totally stuck (on the conveyor belt), like if you had a boat on a sandbar,” Ben said. “It was as if there was not enough water to move it and then the tube with the people hit it and flipped (upright).”
Last edited by Axel on October 31st, 2016, 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By Axel
#91414
Australian amusement ride tragedy: Can it happen here?
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/10/25/australian-amusement-ride-tragedy-can-happen-here/92724794/
If you think an amusement park tragedy like the one that killed four people in Australia on Tuesday can't happen here, Ken Martin says think again.

"It's not a matter of whether it's going to happen, it's when," Martin, an amusement park safety consultant told USA TODAY. "The conditions exist."

Martin says Australia's rides are subject to federal oversight. The U.S. has virtually no federal oversight, with each state "doing their own thing." In some states that is very little, Martin said.

"They will investigate it faster and they will learn more from it than any investigation in the U.S.," Martin said of the Australian probe into what happened.

The U.S. is no stranger to amusement ride horrors. Less than three months ago, a 10-year-old boy died and two women were injured in an accident on a giant slide at Schlitterbahn Waterpark in Kansas. The Kansas City (Kansas) Police Department is conducting an investigation into the cause of the tragedy.
#91454
Death sentence for Wildfire @ Kolmården?

http://www.folkbladet.se/nyheter/norrkoping/dodsdomen-for-wildfire-om4356681.aspx
(You may need to translate the page)

KOLMÅRDEN decision on Wildfires be or not to be is decidedly in the Land and Environmental Court which on Thursday announced the decision.

The decision can be read that the Land and Environmental Court establishes the County Administrative Board in Östergötland decision of 26 February 2015 to abolish the municipality of Norrköping building permits from 8 October 2014. This means that Wildfire is without a building permit and is regarded as a black building.

- That's right, it requires a detailed plan, says Mårten Tagaeus, the zoo's attorney.

Now waiting for the municipality to hear of charge from Kolmarden Zoo on how they intend to do.

- Most likely, they will want to have a plane clearance to proceed with a detailed plan as a basis for a new building permit, says Reidar Svedahl, president of construction and environmental committee.

Is there åkförbud with Wildfire now?

- It's a reasonable tolknig of judgment that you can not have it running.

Will you ensure that Wildfire demolished?

- It is very important that everyone is treated the same way, the same laws apply to Kolmarden Zoo as for individuals who built without a building permit. It is likely that we will ask them to remove Wildfire, says Reidar Svedahl.

At the same time he says that the municipality will do everything to help Kolmarden Zoo when it comes to developing a new zoning plan.

- But it is not unlikely that it will be appealed to the provincial government.

It will take several years, the new plan may be adopted and approved in all instances?

No, not for years, it will go much faster, says Reidar Svedahl.

Christer Fogelmarck, acting president of Kolmarden Zoo is disappointed by the decision.

- We had hoped for a different outcome, but we are well prepared for the different scenarios. Before we know how we should proceed, we will now put us into the reasons for the decision. Then we hit the municipality to evaluate our options.

- Our intention with the Wildfire was that more people would discover and share our passion for Kolmarden and the amazing park as it actually is. We are a family business that reinvest every penny of profit and need long-term stable conditions to be able to continue to invest in our parks, says Christer Fogelmarck.
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